can sharing knowledge be a form of piracy ?

[sandart]

can sharing knowledge be a form of piracy ?

today i was attacked by a fellow crafter so to speak asking me to offer my craft knowledge for free
and if i failed to do so

not really part of the ethos of this forum.

my attitude in charging for teaching my art is classed as unethical and against every rule under the sun according to our friend here
i respect this opinion but it made me think if am honest
logical speaking when i send my kid to school and am expected to pay for his education i never see any wrong doing in that
i would see me sending him to school and not paying as an act of piracy
the data he's collecting there didn't land from the moon
allot of effort was put in it and i do see it as an act of piracy
but that's me
and that's my opinion
i could be wrong and i could be right
be generous with your openings guys

[glasskanvas]

To be honest I don't think you were attacked. It was certainly the most polite attack I've ever seen if you were, at least!

I think people are just a little sceptical as the forum gets pounded by a lot of people offering everything from mobile phones to get rich quick schemes. I don't think the implication was that you should give away your knowledge for free. Rather, that it looks frankly, quite dodgy, to be offering your knowledge for $199. I does look from the outside like another sales pitch and the forum is about a crafting community sharing their experience and not just touting for business.

I hope you don't feel like I'm attacking you either as that certainly isn't my intention.

[Peter]

Forum rule number 9

9, If you wish to advertise/promote your site you have 4 choices 1- email / private message me for our advertising rate… 2 – add your site to www.ukcraftwebsites.co.uk (http://www.ukcraftwebsites.co.uk/) which includes adverts on the forums right hand side, 3 – Add your site to your signature and offer great advice and help to people.. Your reputation will advertise your site itself. 4 – finally try somewhere else to spam ?

what's your problem?:confused:

[sandart]

i didn't make any offers nor mentioned any one will get rich nor even made an offer or an adviretisment

but that's not what am on about here

do u think that charging for knowledge is bad ?

that's what am trying to discuss .!!!!!

i don't have a problem guys lol
am just asking

[Pagan]

I don't think charging for knowledge is necessarilly a bad thing, but charging for it and calling it sharing is a bit ambiguous at best. Sharing implies free. Lets face it, you pay to go to Uni or college, but you know up front it's to be paid for so you have a choice - the Uni or college doesn't call it 'sharing' knowledge or information.

[sandart]

i think i ve priced it wrong u know

and putting that picture of the box didnt really help lol

it made it look like a cheap ****

i think our freind here have a point and his attack did me a favor :pc:

[mummycupcake]

I haven't been a member of this site very long, so wouldn't normally wouldn't get involved in this sort of thread. But on this occasion I'm going to risk sticking my neck out.

I dont think you were attacked in the other post and I think you have mis quoted the other member, I don't think they were asking you to offer anything for free they were just pointing out that you hadn't been upfront about the price of your membership. Infact it looks like you are attacking the other member for mearly answering a question you asked them. Your last post on the other thread said you were going to leave it there so I don't understand why you have started a new thread.

This is a fun, light hearted forum with lots of helpful people. I for one don't have a problem with you charging to teach just be upfront about it.

Just out of interest why do you charge in $ and not £??

[sandart]

coz the main market is in $

i do think there was a misunderstanding someware
i agree


but i never made any offers to any one free or paid

the website have a free section for starters
http://www.sandgallery.com/freetips.html#coloringsand

you can check it out if u r intrested

why i started a new thred
i wana get a wider feed back on this point

[nettie]

I've just read the other thread attached to this. I think if you had put 'learn how to do sand art for $199' at the top of THIS thread then you wouldn't have had many replies. But your 'invite' brought you the views and got people interested without knowing the full story. Your craft/art is amazing and looks very intricate and tricky to do and of course that knowledge and expertise is gathered over time, and that time is worth money, but I think the wording of your first introduction produced the bad feeling and mislead people into the sales pitch. Sorry...

[silvermaid]

I have read both threads and here is my feedback about it.
When I first read ' do you want to learn sand art' I thought it would be a class or course held by you, that people would attend to learn sand art. I accepted that you would charge for this.
I now realise that it was a chance to buy membership to your sand art business.
Unfortunately, this is where you lost me. It appears that the membership fee is just for access to detailed photo's, videos and instructions on how to make sand art. I know this included a small starter kit but it seemed expensive to me. I would not pay $199 to learn it myself at home. I saw that you had 7 day courses advertised on your site but there were no prices and although there was a mention about membership it didn't say whether the course was included or separate to the membership fee.
I did see your free tips section and your video, I thought they were very good.

Melanie

[nattynetty]

my attitude in charging for teaching my art is classed as unethical and against every rule under the sun according to our friend here

I really do not want to be drawn into an arguement especially as it appears you now realise you perhaps over-reacted. However I strongly object to you making up the facts you quoted above - please re-read my original post if you still believe I said or implied this.

[sandart]

i thankd you for your coment and we are over it now dont worry about it mate

i also apologize as well if i corossed any line

lets talk sand now lol

wana get dusty :D

[Peter]

i also apologize as well if i corossed any line



Time for a little clarification here. You did contravene rule 9, although you completely ignored my post advising you of this. You have also decided the moderators of this forum are your 'mates'....................this could be a mistake. You also appear to believe Natty Netty apologised to you - which you magnanimously reciprocated - I think you may have made another mistake here. Sandart, you have promoted your craft and your profession with every post since you joined the forum, maybe it is time to enjoy discussing somebody else's craft, otherwise we - the moderators - may get the impression you are only here to promote yourself, and I'm sure that couldn't be the case, otherwise it would be classed as spam. We look forward to your insights into the many facetted skills of our forum members - we have probably heard all we need to hear of yours. :)

[sandart]

i dont understand

whats your problem >?

where u getting ?

[Peter]

Your posts have been deleted because they only served to justify you advertising your business. You have been advised, and have taken no notice whatsoever of forum moderators, you obviously have no wish to join in the forum discussions therefore I see no other alternative than to recommend you leave the forum or go through the ignomy of a ban. You have pressed your case to the point where you have become boring and are only taking up bandwidth.

[llovegemstones]

I quite like the idea of sharing crafts - one lady I met didnt know how to knot corded jewellery, and I just love knotting, so I showed her a few techniques I have learnt - and I absolutely love sharing it. Along with some of her things she was showing she crochetted - so the next day I brought along a crochet hook and some wool, and she very kindly showed me how to crochet - it was brilliant! We both came away with new skills.

I dont have a problem with sharing my skills, I think it is great to be able to and I love the fact that people enjoy what I do.

Oopsy only just noticed this is a really old post :)

Sally

[jezzabell]

I have to agree with most of crafters here but...

when I joined this forum I thought this is a friendly place to come, meet other people (rather private than business...) share the ideas, tips, techniques...

when I read your first post sandart I already new I am not interested because you made your own thread just to get more traffic on your website and probably get customers and I was thinking how other people can still keep this going?

as I said before I am a member of a big craft forum in my country and we even do (!!!!!) short on-line classes for other members interested in things we make.... for free (?????)
and I have to say that I learned to needle felt with one of the girls instructions...

and to mods: on that forum, every unwanted adds are deleted not to mess up the forum, but all the members are really respecting the rules about it, if they want to sell something they make or do classes for money they have to find other places and this way there is no spam on the forum...

well you can all sent me wherever you want... but this is my view

[jezzabell]

and I am sorry but I don`t want anyone felt touched by my post this was just general view... so please forgive me if I hurt someone`s feelings... :sleep:

[auntynet]

No apology necessary Jezzebel - you just basically backed up what Beadsage was saying. . . . .

That the forum is not a place to generate business but more of a place to chat with fellow crafters, share tips, techniques, ideas and even a joke or two whether those conversations are craft related or not.

Tips and advice (and even tutorials) are given freely by most forum members and everyone is happy to help without the slightest hint of payment for your knowledge.

I am just one of many forum members that have tried to help others and the thought of payment for my knowledge just doesn't enter my head.

[Focus on Life]

To me, the forums a place to chat with like-minded folk and to learn from each other. But even more than that, I know lots of us have made really good virtual (and some real life) friends on the forum which is wonderful and you can certainly rely on friendly, helpful support when you're in need of it - whatever the reason

I've learnt how to make a Blog because of the forum, but I wasnt charged for the help and advice I got along the way

We help each other out proof-checking websites, giving opinions on products, exchanging photography tips, suggesting possible business names - all without charge

Yes we know some of us hope to maintain craft businesses or just earn a few extra pennies from our crafts and although some forum members happily purchase items from each other, that wasnt their first purpose - just a lovely perk when you enjoy someone else's work

Its tricky sometimes, the lines can be blurred when it comes to genuinely contributing to any forum and healthy self-promotion. But reading the rules and just studying the threads for a while should be a good guide if you want it

Shaz x

[Poppy4lee]

Sandart, I do feel that your original post could be viewed as being economical with the truth. In the light of this, your covert approach could be seen as implicit recognition that forum rules were being breached. I really hope that you joined this forum in order to be a participating member and not simply as a springboard for your own business.